Comments on: New Designers and The Moral Imperative

By: Cenk Guven

Cenk Guven — Fri, 25 Jun 2010 01:21:30 +0000

Thank you Eric for bringing up this discussion and the opportunity for designers question themselves, their profession and all about design. I'm a new designer, not even a professional one yet, and have already started questioning all these things. At both schools that I had attended in Vancouver, Langara and BCIT/Emily Carr, Helvetica was shown and this is how most students like myself got familiar with Paula Scher. Her attitude and words in the film were fresh and different from most other designers. She among all others took my attention and respect. However, I'm also one of those people here who cannot get her message in this discussion right. I have reread it a few times and I think the reason we don't get it is that we need examples. I mean Paula Scher says she deals with devilish corporations herself and tries to help them do the right thing all the time, but probably for obvious reasons (client relations, privacy and all) she cannot give us examples, names of those companies and how exactly she helped them, but I'm very very curious as a new design student (as well as an average citizen) how she did/does that... how can we help these devilish corporations do the right thing? Maybe she cannot give company/product names but maybe she can find a way of sharing these lessons with us because it is such an important subject, not from design and designers' point of view but from everyone else's. I really would like to know how those corporations change their ways after a designer like Paula Scher starts working with them? Thank you.

By: Spiros

Spiros — Fri, 04 Jun 2010 09:26:00 +0000

I am torn between the two views, the point of the interview, the ivory towers and all that but i surely love the Discussion. Surely we need more of that. Kudow to both Eric and Paula and to all those commenter that engaged!
Keep it up Eric.

By: Ryan

Ryan — Tue, 25 May 2010 22:07:07 +0000

Albert, why would you weigh into a discussion to add such a useless comment? At least add your full name and take credit for what you probably wouldn't have the guts to say to his face.

By: Eric Karjaluoto

Eric Karjaluoto — Tue, 25 May 2010 21:55:00 +0000

@Sigrid--Thank you! I'm glad you liked the talk. :-) Some clarification: Form is important. I wasn't meaning to say otherwise. My point was simply that in recent years, there has been a proliferation of celebrated design work that doesn't address function whatsoever. In itself this isn't a bad thing, but I tend to categorize such work more as "art" than "design." Such work is about self-expression, instead of solving a problem, and I don't think that on its own really constitutes design. (For the record, I quite enjoy self-expression, but try not to confuse it with what I'm doing in my professional practice.) On the next point--the "perfect" one--I need to clarify. The quote I referenced (which I too am paraphrasing) went something like: "An artist gets something amazing or nothing; a professional gets something amazing or something." I read that remark to mean that one should recognize design as a collaborative process, in which the designer must "bend" from time to time. I think his idea was that while an artist can stick solely to their principles, a professional needs to see the end result as more important than just "getting their way." Then of course, that's just how I interpreted it. And as for the "magic," I agree: that's always an important part. :-) @Albert. I'm tempted to respond "bite me," but instead, I'll ask you to simply reorder your process: Instead of commenting first, try reading, and then *thinking.* Then comment after you've done that for a while. (If the second part is too difficult, please continue insulting people--I'm sure that works quite nicely for you.)

By: Albert

Albert — Tue, 25 May 2010 21:17:47 +0000

I used to like your posts Eric, but I sincerely think you are ranting without any real argumentation, and you are sounding like a resented designer, as if achieving success as Paula has done is a bad thing. I will love to see you turn down a Coca Cola redesign. (That is, if you were that talented to be offered something like that.)

By: Sigrid

Sigrid — Fri, 21 May 2010 17:31:03 +0000

Great lecture last night, Eric! And Paula was excellent too. I am sorry the light was too bright for your presentation.

There has been a discussion going on, on the GDC listserv about graphic design as art and mystery as opposed to what most of us are trying to be now, which is "strategic partners." I for one, think the magic needs to come back a bit. As a visual person, the composition and drama of type and layout is why I went into this profession to begin with.

Like you, I sell myself as a strategist, and with some of my clients I do get to be in the boardroom with the VPs at a planning level. Others just see me as a decorator.

I don't want to be either one, decorator or strategist really, these days I realize I am an artist first of all (just speaking for myself, personally). I am rediscovering art, and trying to bring it back into my graphic design practice.

So while you said that in art, we can make it "perfect" (I may be misquoting you) while in design, we try to make it "work", I somewhat disagree. Design is all about the end product. Design clients really don't care that much about the process. Whereas I've only recently realized, art can be all about process and does not have to be about product.

Like many designers I've spoken to recently who were affected by the recession last year, I have rediscovered art. I have been a designer for 21 years, and I have felt the burn out over the last couple of year, but this past year I had more time for art, and it's been very inspiring. So I am rethinking my view of myself as a "strategic creative partner" and coming back to the fact I am foremost an artist.

By: Greg Scraper

Greg Scraper — Mon, 12 Apr 2010 20:56:10 +0000

I think what Paula is saying is absolutely true. Designers want to do "cool" work. "Cool" is album artwork and museum posters; "cool" is book covers and local coffee shops. It's all ensconced in what we've been told that our profession was. The fact is, that 90-95% of our work is corporate in nature, and if everyone who's good is off making pretty dancer posters, someone's got to do the crappy work, and it won't be anyone who's good. I think that's it, that's the sum of her message. Do good work everywhere, so that our value as designers isn't deprecated.

By: Gunnar Andreassen

Gunnar Andreassen — Sun, 11 Apr 2010 15:19:28 +0000

@Andrew Sabatier: I almost feel provoked, many products and sites depend on good design to even be sellable. And its not a given, not at all.

By: Ryan

Ryan — Thu, 08 Apr 2010 20:20:02 +0000

Eric, I do disagree with distorting the facts in design. Dishonesty is wrong regardless of profession. I am lucky to work in-house for a large corporation I believe does good, honest work and I have no reservations about doing the job I was hired to do. I guess what I have a problem with is the judgment implied by some that work is worth more if it is done for cultural institutions. Don't get me wrong, that kind of work is also great.

I will be sure to check out that book. Thanks for the recommendation.

By: Eric Karjaluoto

Eric Karjaluoto — Thu, 08 Apr 2010 20:16:52 +0000

I know I've already noted this, but I must stress that I remember saying very similar things, not so long ago.

The Philip Morris scenario you illustrate is a good one, but I ask you to take it one step further.

The janitor or accountant, for the most part, performs a service that is "closed." The job is done, the labor is paid for, and all's pretty much finished. The books are balanced, the floor is clean... that's it.

The designer, however, has to recognize that their work isn't quite so innocuous: it lives on. That new campaign proposing that smoking is fun, liberating, or a social statement of some sort affects how people view cigarettes.

So a child with still undeveloped critical thinking skills considers trying one. Or, a regular smoker feels a little reassured that they're not alone in buying another pack. Or, someone trying to quit has one more reason to put that off another day.

I don't know about you; perhaps you can put that out of your mind. A lot of us can't, though, and this sort of thing doesn't end with the tobacco industry.

Lots of people live crummier lives because of the lies they've been told. I know this sounds like a conspiracy theory or leftist commentary of some sort... until you realize that it's really just the way it is.